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Brisbanehomoeopath
Sameer

In your opinion, what is the root cause of her problems?

Hmm..chose what you feel is best as BH said, but I am quite confident that Lachesis is THE remedy here :)

BH, with due respect to your analysis, There are some pretty strong keynotes of Lachesis here which are not quite there in Lyssin.

One of them being Fear of men [=male persons].

Another one being 'Suspicion'

Another one being the 'Discouraged' state of the patient.

I would be very interested to hear how the response is to Lachesis or Lyssin. Either ways, I am fine if you try one and then try the other if it does not work.

I have no problem with Sameer's analysis either, so you choose one, lets see how it goes, then if necessary you can try the other, or we can reassess the reaction to see if anything new comes up.

I always try to match the state to the patient, which might mean that some of the specific symptoms don't show in a repertory search. Depending on what problem you are trying to treat, will change which remedy you might choose to some degree.

Lyssin doesn't show in the repertory for Suspicious, and yet they always imagine they are being attacked, and are wary of people approaching them for that reason (= suspicious of other's intentions)

Lyssin feels tormented and tortured by others, and always assumes those stronger then them are going to abuse and harm them (so can be afraid of men who are primarily seen as agressors)

Lyssin feels very unfortunate, they feel insulted and criticized. They feel unhappy, depressed, as if something bad will happen to them (which can result in them feeling discouraged).

When I did my first repertory analysis, the top two remedies were Stramonium and Lyssin - two remedies that can look very much alike. Lachesis was third. So I have no problem at all with Sameer's idea it is close to mine - we can only try them out to see which one works.

No homoeopath is infallible, whenever we give a remedy it is always a theory, hopefully with good justification of course. We need to test the theory to see how appropriate it is.

Fair enough BH :)

Let's hope that the patient does get better, with your prescription or mine :)

Two minds, two perspectives, can only be a bonus :)

Hi Sorrel,

The following are very good sources to read about Lyssin, and Lachesis.

http://www.homeoint.org/seror/nosodes/lyssin.htm

lach.htm " rel="nofollow noopener" target="_blank">http://www.homeoint.org/books3/kentmm/lach.htm

Hope it helps you make a better informed decision.

Sameer

I will post a detailed description of Lyssin drawn from my clinical computer program Reference Works a bit later today.

Typically in a case like this I would start with a single dose of 200c, liquid dose, diluted further into an amount of water.

Nawazkhan I am sorry I missed your question earlier. In terms of what is the cause of the problem, that is not quite so important as the way she presents the problem. It appears to be a history of domination and abuse, but this is common to many people and will not give you the remedy on its own.

The causation of Lyssin, should that be her remedy, is to be tormented by people, to be tortured by them, until you must lash out violently to protect yourself. Lyssin is mad with pain and anger, biting those who come near, friend or foe.

From Dr Gibson:

The emotional features of Lachesis are characteristic. It is suggested that they derive from a 'state of anxiety', restlessness and hypersensitivity due to a threat of an eruption of repressed emotionality and sexuality.

Typically an unstable, ego centric individual, full of schemes and projects.

Liable to be self-conscious, selfish, conceited, jealous, even suspicious without cause.

Unbearable anxiety and anguish, especially on first waking from sleep. Usually wide awake, and alert in the evening, during the night becomes melancholy and depressed and is even more so after night's sleep. This is the grand Lachesis characteristic of aggravation after sleep and sleeping into an aggravation.

There is a tendency to apprehensive irritability, alternation of gloom and fury, taciturnity and confusion of time sense.

Great sensitivity to all stimuli, but especially to touch and noise. Slight pressure aggravates them, but firm pressure and massage ameliorates them. Noise in intolerable even at a distance. May in fact 'fear noises' and become paranoic or show manic depressive tendencies.

A peculiar sensation or fear is 'of someone lurking behind', which can result in unwillingness to turn back towards anyone or to even sit in the forward seats in a bus.

Other features recorded include: 'sees the blackest side of everything','puts the worst possible interpretation on the most innocent facts',' apt to lay plans to hurt people and hatch evil plots','in a constant hurry and flap; must do everything quickly' everyone must hurry'.

Selected materia medica notes for Lyssin:-

Lyssinum belongs to the acute miasm. It cannot be strictly classified as a remedy of the animal kingdom since it represents only one aspect of the dog, the tremendous aggressiveness that has gone out of control.
The saliva of the rabid dog creates a state of pain. It is the state of a controlled animal gone crazy: the dog that obeyed the master but was treated so badly that it lost all its control, and jumped on and tore at its own master.
The main feeling of Lyssinum is of having suffered wrong, being tormented, especially by one whom he has served, has been faithful to and is dependent on, thus creating an intense feeling of anger and rage, in which the person can bite, strike and even violently mutilate. Often this rage is followed by a repentance as profound as the rage was violent. Or it may be an impotent anger which can lead to an impulse to stab himself.
Lyssinum is required in a situation where a person has to lash out against somebody because, if he keeps quiet, he will be further tormented. But this rage has to be followed by quick repentance, because if it persists too long, it is not good for him as he is, after all, dependent.
The heightened sensitivity of Lyssinum (as for example to light and noise) is a characteristic feature of its alertness. Lyssinum will respond to any situation in this manner. For example if the roof is leaking, he may tolerate it for some time, but then get so angry that he will take a hammer and break the plaster. A few minutes later when his anger subsides, he will get cement and will fix it up again.

Thus the Lyssinum situation is one of being tormented by someone or something on which one is dependent - a torment that is not merely an insult but actually causes physical and mental pain. It brings about rage, an insane rage, wildness, fury, biting

LEADING SYMPTOMS:
Sudden, explosive FITS of anger. Frantic rage, especially if annoyed, obstructed or TORMENTED.
OUTBURST of DESTRUCTIVENESS: impulse to cut, bite, stab, destroy and kill.
Outbursts followed by quick repentance.
Delusion he has SUFFERED WRONG, delusion he is tormented. Delusion other people, especially people on whom he is dependent, deliberately try to annoy him. 'Whenever dependence which not only exists in the relationship between people but also in the relationship between man and his house, his machines, etc. and torment are seen together and the torment is episodic or periodic in its course, one is reminded of Lyss' [Sankaran].
'The Staph.-situation is similar but on a much milder level. It is a situation of being unjustly treated by a person on whom he is dependent and so there is the need for justice. There is an insulted feeling, suppressed anger, occasional violent outbursts of anger, but it is not like the rage of Lyss., with its biting and kicking. It is not a situation of being tormented like Lyss. but just being treated unfairly. Staph tells you to get out., whereas Lyss takes a stick and pokes your ribs three times a day' [Sankaran].
OVERACUTE SENSES [consequently more sensitive to being annoyed, obstructed or tormented].

The main feeling of Lyss is The Feeling Of Being Tormented.
Del., tormented that she is (China, Lyss)
Praying
Violence
Mortification
Impulse to kill
Impulse to stab his flesh with the knife he held
Forsaken feeling
Fancies that he has suffered wrong
Anger alternating with quick repentance (Croc)
Rage followed by repentance (Croc)
With these fundamental rubrics, let us construct the situation of Lyss.
Rage alternating with quick repentance (Croc Lyss). What is the meaning of this rubric?
Rage is violent anger, almost frenzied violence. It is required in a situation where a person has to lash out against somebody because if he keeps quiet, he will be further troubled. But this rage has to be followed by repentance because if it persists too long, it is not good for him. He has to repent and this gives the idea that the rage is directed towards somebody on whom he is dependent but who is troubling him also. This is the situation of both Lyss and Croc. But this is the only common feature of the situation; otherwise there is differences between the situations.
The Lyssin situation is one of a woman who is being insulted, tormented and injured by her own husband, the very person on whom she is dependent, and she reacts with rage. The rage is quite violent in Lyss. It is wild behavior with the impulse to cut, bite, stab and kill. This is because Lyss is not merely being troubled, but is actually tormented. There is a threat, so she becomes very sensitive and dog-like behavior sets in:
Del. he is a dog
Growling like a dog
If you hurt a dog too much and then touch him, he will growl, become wild and will bite. So whenever people trouble him again, he becomes violent and gets into a rage. Later on he cools down.

Lyss is a situation of being tormented by a person on whom she is dependent. The torment is episodic or periodical and the person needs to react to it with rage which is followed by quick repentance. This is the situation of Lyss, but it can take various forms in a child, in a man or in a woman. Not only can it exist in the relationship between people, but also in the relationship between a man and his house or his machine, etc.
Whenever dependence and torment are seen together and the torment is episodic or periodic in its course, one is reminded of Lyss.

I am fine with your choice, however, just to clarify, some of the reasons you gave:

- the need to deal with the excess saliva and spitting etc in the mornings - primarily in the shower. It's been going on for near on a year now, and it's getting me down. My GP just brushes it aside.

[SV]: Lachesis has all sorts of excess salivations.


- that it's frantic rage.

[SV]: Lachesis can be wild with rage as well.

- the forsaken feeling.

[SV]: Lachesis is a very strong remedy in the forsaken rubric.


- although to some I might appear as egocentric, it actually masks a very insecure, fragmented, frightened, not yet mature or developed ego.

[SV]: This is in general a very sycotic trait a miasm Lachesis covers very well.


- I also read that Lyssin craves chocolate!

[SV]: So does Lachesis.

- I do feel worse in the mornings, but actually ok when asleep. Because 'no one can get me there', and I'm in maximum medicated sedation. Waking up feels too much of a wrench back into life/the world.

[SV]: Aggravation in the mornings is huge in Lachesis :)

There are a couple of things to keep in mind when starting homoeopathic treatment.

1. Mental health cases can be somewhat tricky. A large majority of my cases are mental health cases in clinic. It is important to realize that the medicines are not magic, they are like concentrated burst of therapy and counselling. This can make the first week or two tough, as the issues temporarily aggravate. It is vital that you have some kind of support available to you - I would offer this to patients I see in person, but you will need to put yourself into the safest environment you can.

2. If you are currently on medication, it is also important to remain on it, at your normal dosage, until you are certain that you are improving. After improvement is clear, then we can discuss the idea of reducing it slowly.

3. Don't start any new treatments until the effect of the homoeopathy is clear, including massage and acunpuncture.

4. Don't suppress any physical symptoms that come up after the remedy begins working, especially if there is mental or emotional improvment accompanying it.

5. If at all possible, any acute crisis that appears during treatment should also be handled with homoeopathy. However, do not put your health at risk while waiting for an answer from one of us here. Again, typically I can make myself available to my clients via phone but with time differences and various real life commitments we can miss your cry for help.

6. It is important to allow a remedy time to work. Both Sameer and I practice using the principle of Single Remedy and Minimum Dose. Long term issues like this may take a few weeks to see definite improvement, but there will always be some kind of reaction within the first week.

If you don't feel up to taking a medicine right now then that is ok. You will know better than us how strong you feel.

I don't believe that 30c would produce much of a result - the intensity and depth of your disease is probably beyond it. But again, it is your choice, as long as you feed back to us whatever happens.

My experience with mental health cases is that they feel supported by the remedy as it goes to work. While it can be powerful, underneath the patient will feel something guiding the movement of their health.

Hi bris,

If the remedy is the simillimum, even a 30c should produce some movement in the right direction, albeit for shorter time, and less profound.

I have actually started a majority of my mental health cases with 30c, and not even once have I not had a favorable response when the remedy was the simillimum.

But since, it is your prescription of Lyssin she is trying, the final decision is of-course yours.

I just wanted to let you know about my experience.

Sameer

I am happy to colaborate even on the potency selection Sameer. I find it easier to assess that in person - 30c is fine if you think that will do something good for her :)

What about using LM potencies?

In my experience, LMs are by far the most penetrating of all scales, and with a remedy like Lyss, which is very violent in its symptoms, I would only shift to LMs once some benefit has happened with a 30c to confirm the remedy choice.

Please go ahead with a single 30c water dose in my opinion.

I have no problem with that at all. Let's see what happens.

Dear Sorrel, Good Morning, in my considered opinion, we are going in the wrong direction, both of the great minds have missed the whole thing. You see a correct remedy selection comes with skill and experience, no doubt they have a wealth of experience with pride, but, here thru the use of computer programs and reference books, it could be misleading especially both of them are showing lack of confidence and frustration at the moment. I hope and pray that they don't mind and respect constructive criticism. Again, this is my opinion as reading your posts, I strongly belive you don't need these 2 remedies involving dogs and snakes, these might create such habits in the person taking it. Your state and symptoms are not that serious and no one wants to open a can of worms. We must never create problems that will be hard to undo in the future.

Finally, it is after midnight and I want to go to sleep, just thought I am obligated to give my opinion with the hope that you guys will not mind as I have great respect for you both.

My work to study this case resulted in Conium as all of the problems have been created with the suppression of sex, in my opinion again. one might have a look again at http://www.vithoulkas.com/content/view/109/9/lang,en/

A bundle of prayers for your good health, happiness and well-being.

Regards
Nawaz

Everyone has a right to express their opinion here. As I am so fond of saying, it is a public forum :)

For myself, the choice of a remedy is about matching the state of the remedy to the the state of the patient. State does not necessarily equal all the little symptoms but the threads that connect them all. Causation can be important, but it does not override the presenting state. Causation should only help to justify a choice when the rest of the case agrees.

What else in this case agrees with a prescription of Conium?

This is my understanding of the state of Conium...

LEADING SYMPTOMS:
* GRADUAL paralysis and weakness with indurations:
Mental: gradual weakening of memory; lack of sharpness in all senses.
Emotional: indifference and hardness; materialist with great attachment to the material world. Because of this materialism, Con. subsequently suffers from the loss of a sexual partner.
Physical: indurations and tumours; cancerous affections.
Gradual paralysis with a SLOW onset and for the most part UNNOTICED. 'Will only talk about this gradual decline after one or two follow-ups, after they actually experience an uplift in their energy and general state. It is usually only in hindsight, after receiving Conium, that they then see how limited they were and how much more freedom and spontaneity they now have.'
'Paucity of symptoms on the emotional level and a kind of INTROVERSION. Patient is not forthcoming… Lack of emotional and mental range leading to a lack of emotional and mental expression. The amount of emotional or mental response from the patient is not in proportion to what you expect from their history. You may see that in the past this person suffered a tremendous amount emotionally. You see in the past significantly more expressivity of emotion than is now being expressed by the patient in front of you.'
'Gradual SHUTTING DOWN ultimately results in isolation and even an AVERSION to COMPANY. Patient gradually becomes more isolated and therefore does not complain about the lack of company.'
'Gradual shutting down leads to rigidity and even ritualistic and compulsive behaviour, especially rigidity about diet and healt They develop rigid concepts about health and diet. They then narrow down their diet and stick to it without much difficulty.'
'Kind of self-satisfaction with their state. They have and express less anxiety relative to the situation than their background suggests they would. They may even exhibit a complete lack of anxiety when faced with an uncertain future and poor prognosis regarding their pathology. In the first interview they definitely would not consider themselves sick mentally or emotionally, or even limited on these levels. Most Conium patients are proud of their ability to be calm, even and organized, both internally and externally, when confronted with an emotionally charged situation.'


In many ways this seems completely unlike the patient.

Just because I disagree with the idea doesn't mean that it is incorrect. Again, as I am often saying, nobody knows for sure that a medicine will help until the patient is helped by it. We all make incorrect prescriptions, probably more often than we like to admit.

As always, the decision has to remain in the hands of the patient on a forum like this, where many opinions will be offered.

Dear Brisbanehomoeopath,

Many many Thanks for your usual professional response and above all your decision to suggest remedies now.

Your kind help, untiring efforts and true statements are greatly appreciated.

Please always remember, the reward will only come from your creator, The God Almighty.

Lastly, I would like to say that You Are Also my HERO.

A lot of sincere prayers for your success, more sustenance, more knowledge, more strength, more patience and more peace of mind.

Regards
Nawaz

Please don't take.

Bring another bottle, put just 1 or 2 in.

In water dosing, number of pillules does matter.


Take a teaspoon from there just once.