≡ ▼
ABC Homeopathy Forum


The ABC Homeopathy Forum

Some help with Nat. Mur? Thanks in advance!

On Sunday 2/16 I started taking Natrum Muriaticum 6c 4 pellets 1x per day for a cold sore that was coming on. After three days of taking the remedy, not only had the cold sore healed but I started to notice I was feeling great for the first time in 4 years (since the birth of my child). Struggles I was having with acne, bloating, depression, grief, mood swings, inability to let go and move on, low libido and a general lack of interest in life were all decreasing. For 4 years I’ve walked around feeling as if there was a glass wall between me and the outside world and no way to penetrate it. But suddenly, after taking the Nat Mur, I could feel the wall coming down. I read a few descriptions of Nat Mur and they fit me to the letter. So, I continued taking the remedy - 4 pellets 1x per day, one hour after rising (5:30am).

As of Monday, (the 24th), I was feeling amazing! Almost back to my “normal” self - a self that I had not had access to in 4 years. Then yesterday I had to take the remedy in the afternoon (12:30pm) instead of in the morning (5:30am), and everything started to change. By mid afternoon I was so exhausted I couldn’t keep my eyes open and fell asleep for 5hours (that never happens!). When I woke up, all of my symptoms felt as if they had returned. In the time I was asleep new acne I surfaced on my face, my bloat had returned (so much so, that I couldn’t get my previously loose rings off) I was no longer peaceful or happy and the wall that had been coming down, was firmly back up. I started crying out of feelings of anger and frustration and starting wailing, “It’s all back. All the symptoms are back. Why??? I was doing better!” The wave of grief and anguish that came over me after that was indescribable.

After that I went to bed and woke up this morning in a similar, but less intense state. I took my remedy at 5:30am as usual and immediately started to feel more tense, anxious and irritable. By 6:30am I had calmed somewhat but still felt angry. By 7:30 I was feeling frantic and desperate to figure out what had gone wrong and how I could fix it. By 8am a wash of calm came over me for no real reason and I started to feel a bit better. Nowhere near as good as I had felt, but the intensity of the grief and irritability had vanished. It was around that time that I read that perhaps I had taken too much Nat Mur and that I should antidote it. So I took a huge sniff of my husband’s coffee. As I write this (around 9am), I feel stable and calm, but still as if that glass wall is back up between me and the rest of the world.

So, I’m unsure what to do now. I’m guessing I should stop the remedy? But for how long?

Any and all advice on how to proceed from here would be greatly appreciated!!

Many thanks!
  flowermama on 2014-02-27
This is just a forum. Assume posts are not from medical professionals.
Having the glass wall come back is probably just more
of the old symptoms being there bc you took too much.

Just wait, don't take any more and see how you are doing
in a few days. One sniff of coffee is not going to erase
the entire remedy, the excess should wear off.

Everyone has different reactions and needs doses based on
what the remedy is doing in their body. When a remedy
starts to act, you stop dosing. You wait until symptoms return,
to take another dose or if you plateau. The gaps between
doses should get longer and longer if the remedy is correct.
simone717 8 years ago
Thank you so much for the reply! I'll stop the remedy and wait and see what happens.

Since right now I feel as bad as I did before I started the remedy in the first place, will stopping the remedy bring me back to feeling good as I did a few days ago? I guess I want to be clear about changes I'm to be on the lookout for.

Thank you SO much!!!!
flowermama 8 years ago
Yes, that could happen unless the coffee really did something to you-
but the only way to know is to wait and see if the good feelings
show up again in a few days.
simone717 8 years ago
Thank you again for the quick reply! I'll wait a few days and see what happens and report back.

Thank you so much!!

flowermama 8 years ago
If you have stumbled on your simillimum (deep acting remedy) you are very fortunate indeed. Progress on such a remedy must be monitored and assessed carefully though, as the process is different to that of using a true acute remedy.

This is the problem with self-prescribing. You need to understand the rules for dosing, and what the various responses mean in order to avoid causing trouble. These rules are extremely important for getting the most out of any remedy that is acting to relieve the chronic state.

There are a couple of issues here with the way you are dosing.

Firstly, you shouldn't be using the pillules directly. Pillules should be dissolved into water before being taken. Pillules are more likely to aggravate and cause side effects than diluted doses.

Secondly, for repeating the same remedy in the same potency, you should have the pillules mixed into water inside of a small bottle, preferably with a dropper. This bottle needs to be hit firmly against the palm of the hand (or other elastic surface) several times before a dose is taken. This ensures the potency has been altered slightly, which provides a greater and gentler effect. Not altering the potency with each dose means it may become less effective, or create new symptoms, or (as may have happened here) stir up the old symptoms again.

Depending on your sensitivity (and reaction to previous doses) the drops you take from this bottle after hitting (succussing) it may also need to be further diluted into more water. The number of drops and amount of water can be varied to suit the particular situation, but I usually start with 3 hits, 3 drops, 200mls of water as a starting point. Out of that water, I ask the patient to take 2 teaspoons. This water is then thrown away, and fresh water used if another dose is taken.

Thirdly, there are general guidelines for taking subsequent doses.

Most importantly, you should STOP the moment any of your symptoms worsen. This is a sign the remedy has acted, and any further doses while the aggravation is taking place will only make things worse or possibly reverse the curative action (in effect cancelling itself out).

Just as important though, is to stop if your symptoms markedly improve. Again, further doses will almost certainly interrupt the beneficial effect, re-provoking the symptoms or cancelling out the positive effect.

And lastly, if any new symptoms arise (not old symptoms from the past - that is actually an excellent sign) you should immediately stop using the remedy and have the situation assessed. It is possible the remedy might graft new symptoms on to your vital energy, or it could be suppressing your normal symptoms and driving the disease more deeply in.

As Simone717 has suggested you will need to wait it out and see if the aggravation dies down and leaves improvement behind.
[message edited by Evocationer on Fri, 28 Feb 2014 01:13:37 GMT]
Evocationer 8 years ago
Thank you so much for this in depth reply! What wonderful information. Thank you for taking the time to explain dosing to me.

Honestly, I never intended to take this remedy for more than a few days to help the cold sore. But when it began to act on much deeper, longer standing issues, I got very excited and carried on. I never thought I'd get out from under the heaviness I've been living under and to see it lift felt like a miracle!

And the reason I used the pellets is because in two previous experiences with homeopaths I was prescribed pellets both times. So I just followed what I already knew how to do. The water method you described makes lots of sense though and I'll try it going forward.

So, it's 9pm now and I feel markedly better than I did this morning. Not as good as I did a few days ago, but much much better. That 'glass wall' I mentioned in my first post is coming down again and I feel the 'real me' slowly coming back online. I will obviously discontinue the remedy and continue to wait and see how things progress.

Any further insight or recommendations are greatly appreciated!!!

Many, many thanks!
flowermama 8 years ago
A brief update:

I went to sleep last night feeling really well and woke up this morning feeling even better. Almost as good as I did earlier in the week.

Then, around mid morning, I crashed and all of my symptoms came flooding back - except my acne. There's nothing new there (very thankful for that!). But aside from the acne, I'm firmly back where I started before taking the Nat. Mur in the first place.

Any thoughts or suggestions are greatly appreciated!
flowermama 8 years ago
Take another dose using the 3 drops in 200 ml of water with
3 hits on the bottle, 2 tsps. Just once dose.

You can report 24 hours later on what is going on and see
how long the dose lasts before you go backwards again.
simone717 8 years ago
Thank you!!

Just so I'm crystal clear (don't want to throw myself into another tailspin), I take 3 pellets, dissolve them in 200 ml of water, hit the bottle 3 times and then take 2 tsps from that water? (I think I might be confused.)

Thank you for clarifying!
flowermama 8 years ago
Ok I think I figured it out. Here's how I understand liquid dosing. Please correct me where I'm wrong!

1) dissolve pellets in water (how many pellets?)

2) take 3 drops of that water and add it to 200ml of water, preferably in dropper bottle

3) hit the bottle 3 times

4) take 2tsp of that water one time and wait 24 hours

Am I close?

Thanks again!!!
flowermama 8 years ago

Just take 3 pills and dissolve in 200 ml of water in a plastic bottle-
then hit the bottle hard against your hand or a book 3 times.

Then take two teaspoons out of that bottle for one dose.

Throw the rest away.
simone717 8 years ago
Awesome. Thank you for clarifying! I'll take it this evening and check back in late tomorrow.
flowermama 8 years ago
The instructions I gave were:

Dissolve pillules into water inside of a small bottle preferably with a dropper.

Number of pillules I usually use is 2, but 1-3 is fine.

Hit the bottle 3 times.

Place 3 drops into 200mls of clean water.

Stir thoroughly.

Take 2 teaspoons out of this water and take that into the mouth. Throw that water away (not the water in the bottle).

Each dose should be done this way, starting from the step where you hit the bottle.
Evocationer 8 years ago
Hi- don't worry if you did the dose
the way I told you. It is a common
way to do a wet dose-Homeopaths
all have different ways they dose.PLUSSED DOSE

Rinse a clean glass jar and lid in very hot water and let them cool. Measure 1/4 cup of filtered or distilled water and pour it into the jar. Without touching the pellets, place 2 or 3 pellets into the water.
Allow 15 minutes for the pellets to dissolve.
With the lid securely on, pound the bottom of the jar against the palm of your hand the number of times specified in our instructions. Alternately, one can cascade the mixture with a spoon, lifting it up with the spoon and pouring it back into the jar the specified number of times.
Take one teaspoon of the mixture, and either save the remainder for subsequent doses or throw it away if only one dose is prescribed.
simone717 8 years ago
Thank you both for the replies and advice concerning dosing. I did take one liquid dose last night per simone717's instructions.

Here's an update:

- Last night before taking the remedy I was despondent. Sobbing with intense feelings of grief and despair. Life looked hopeless. This is not unusual when I'm in the negative state of what seems to be a cycle.

- About an hour after I took the liquid dose of the remedy, I was lying in bed for sleep and felt a wash of peace, calm and happiness come over me. I could very specifically feel the 'real' me coming online and that 'glass wall' coming down. I fell asleep in very good spirits, confident that the remedy was working.

- I awoke this morning edgy, irritable and on the verge of tears. My bloat had returned as did one spot of acne (to be fair, it's in a hard place to see so it could have been there yesterday before taking the remedy). All in all I didn't feel as bad as I did yesterday before the remedy, but close.

- As the day has worn on the edginess has disappeared but has been replaced with an apathy and a lethargy that I'm familiar with as part of my 'cycle'.

- I felt so exhausted around lunch that I could not keep my eyes open. I went to lay down and immediately fell asleep HARD for about 2 hours. This is very unusual.

- When I woke up I felt disoriented, groggy, very dry (eyes, throat, skin), hungry and a bit irritable again.

- As of now, I feel pretty numb emotionally and very disconnected from life. 'The wall' is back.

I really am confused about what's possibly going on and, as always, am very appreciative of any insights or recommendations!!

Many, many thanks!
flowermama 8 years ago
You have to wait again.

You felt mentally better after the remedy which is a good sign.

Then you had old past things come up-which is also how
remedies are supposed to work.

And you had one new thing come up- or maybe the falling
asleep is not new??

This will pass. Note what goes on the next couple days
and report.
simone717 8 years ago
Actually, this reaction might be cause for concern.

Generally speaking, the correct order for response should be aggravation FOLLOWED by amelioration. This will result in long term, if not permanent, improvement. When amelioration comes first, and is then followed by aggravation, this is usually a sign of palliation.

We need to watch very carefully at this point. Do not repeat the remedy, as repeated palliation, if that is what this is, will become suppression over time.

Generally when old symptoms return, they do so as part of the aggravation stage, rather than happening after the amelioration.

However, it is always important to watch for awhile to see how things settle, as Simone717 quite rightly suggests. It is difficult in these situations to know if waiting is the right response, as nobody here will have the same confidence in the prescription they would have if they had made the prescription.
Evocationer 8 years ago
Thank you both again for your thoughts and recommendations. I truly appreciate it.

Obviously, yes, I'll stop the remedy and see what happens. I'd say that most of what I'm experiencing is old stuff. It's hard to really say if the sleepiness and dryness are really new symptoms or not. They have not been a part of the cycle I've been going through since my daughter was born, but they are things I've experienced in my life before to some degree.

If it would help, I'm happy to give you a clearer picture of what's been going on with me and am extremely open to suggestions for different remedies. As I said, I happened upon the Nat Mur quite by accident, only ever expecting to use it for a few days for a cold sore.

Please let me know if you'd like further information about my situation. If not, I'll wait a couple of days and report back next week.

Thank you both, very much!
flowermama 8 years ago
Well if you like you can work on giving your complete case here. I would be happy to analyse it and if necessary make some further suggestions.

Evocationer 8 years ago
That is one hefty intake form! I'll get started on it, but it's going to take a while to complete.

In the meantime, here's an update:

Sunday and Monday I felt GREAT! Right back to the way I was feeling early last week before everything went downhill. I was perfectly 'me'.

This morning I woke up ok, but in the last hour I've felt anxiety and irritation creeping in and I can see those old dark feelings on the horizon. It literally feels like a storm is rolling in and I'm desperate to outrun it or get it to stop altogether. I am terrified of this darkness and grief coming back and the same old cycle taking hold. I can feel it rising and am doing everything I can think of to keep it from erupting.

Does this mean it's time for another dose?

As always, I am deeply grateful for any recommendations you have!!
flowermama 8 years ago
Wait for E-bc he is taking your case.

My opinion is that the potency is too low. I think you
need to try the dose in a 30c in water.
simone717 8 years ago
I agree that it could be an issue with potency. Without knowing enough about the case though it is risky to keep going up in potency without knowing with some confidence that the remedy is the right one.

You would also be going into a healing crisis. This is the problem with accidentally taking a remedy which is deep acting. It may begin the process of healing, and this needs to be managed properly now.
Evocationer 8 years ago
Many thanks, as usual! I'll get working on that intake form and post it as soon as I can so we can confidently move on.

I appreciate your both taking the time today to respond.
flowermama 8 years ago

Post ReplyTo post a reply, you must first LOG ON or Register


Information given in this forum is given by way of exchange of views only, and those views are not necessarily those of ABC Homeopathy. It is not to be treated as a medical diagnosis or prescription, and should not be used as a substitute for a consultation with a qualified homeopath or physician. It is possible that advice given here may be dangerous, and you should make your own checks that it is safe. If symptoms persist, seek professional medical attention. Bear in mind that even minor symptoms can be a sign of a more serious underlying condition, and a timely diagnosis by your doctor could save your life.